Can the Prodigal Son be an Evangelistic Talk? 03

10 05 2009
Rembrandt's The Return of the Prodigal Son
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I don’t want to drag this out into too many posts, so let me just cut to the chase – Most authors today agree that Luke is writing to help his readers see why Christianity is the real fulfillment of God’s history for his people. It is written to Gentile Christians who are a bit worried that they might be riding the wrong horse (see Luke 1:1-4).

So what is the role of these three parables? On the one hand they exposes Jewish exclusiveness. On the other they affirms that God loves those who apparently have no right to be included among his people. If we look to chapter 16 and discussion about using worldly mammon to get people into the kingdom, there seems to be a message in the lost parables, for Christians – don’t forget God has a heart for those who are yet to come in, just as he had a heart for you! Don’t be like the elder brother and the religious leaders who are exclusive and have no thought for lost ones.

Yes these parables are meant to challenge an elitist attitude. But this doesn’t mean they don’t have a secondary word to the lost. The Christian audience themselves would be reminded that they were once lost and God was pleased to seek them out. This reminder (I think) can be used directly with non-Christians when preaching these parables to them.

So should we preach about the older brother or the younger brother? It can and should be preached in terms of exclusivism – both Jesus’ setting and Luke’s setting seem to make this reasonable. But I also think Jesus’ setting and Luke’s setting make it reasonable to focus on “the Lost.” In so far as he reminds his Gentile audience of the way God loved and sought themĀ  this can be well applied to people who aren’t Christians yet. IN NOTICING THE IMPORTANT PLACE OF THE OLDER BROTHER THEREFORE, WE SHOULDN’T FALL TO AN EXTREME AND FORGET THAT LOTS OF DETAILS ABOUT THE FATHER’S LOVE FOR THE YOUNGER BROTHER (not to mention the sheep and the coin) ARE INCLUDED! This chapter is still a great resource for evangelistic preaching.

Posted by Bruce Lowe

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Can the Prodigal Son be an Evangelistic Talk? 02

6 05 2009
Dark Secret ..
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There are at least a couple of questions that need to be answered, and the first is: Who was Jesus talking to, when he gave these three parables? The answer I reckon, was both “the lost” tax collectors and sinners (15:1) and the Pharisees and scribes (15:2). The Greek is ambiguous in v. 3 when it says “he told them this parable”, but for various reasons (e.g. Greek verbs in vv. 1-2), I think it is safest to say he’s speaking to both.

In this way, all the nice things he says about the lost sheep, coin and son are all a positive statement to the “lost listeners” whom historically he is addressing. All the negative things he say about the 99 being left in open country and the older brother, are directed towards the grumbling religious leaders.

But there’s another question: How was Luke trying to effect his audience? This is a really important question to ask. Often when we look at a passage in the gospels we think of it only in terms of the history of the event. But we need to ask how different authors are trying to use these events. Mark and Matthew on the calming of the storm have different purposes and so a sermon on the same event would have very different purposes if preached from Mark or Matthew.

We’ll pick up this question in the next entry, but for now it should be notice that in terms of Jesus’ own audience, “the lost” are certainly on the radar…

Posted by Bruce Lowe

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Conversation with an Atheist Friend (07)

4 05 2009
Statue of David Hume. Taken by Storkk in Edinb...
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Me: When you say there’s only the bible, that’s a cheap dismissal, since the documents were circulated separately and only compiled hundreds of years later. So to dismiss it out of hand is like dismissing the books in a library because they are all housed in the same location.

I’m not sure how else God could evidence himself to people – 1) have predictions about Jesus’ coming hundreds of years in advance (we have records from Isaiah dating from significantly before Jesus was born) ; 2) have paradoxical predictions (king, yet he’ll suffer and die) so the Jews themselves were struggling to understand, but in the end it ties together, to show it wasn’t just made up; 3) be born at a moment when so many factors were conducive to the spread of such a message from him (common language, pax Romana); 4) have philosophical thought near its pinnacle so that his life and how it fit in could be best interpreted (BTW, both “modernism” and “postmodernism was around in the first century); 5) God come as a human so we could relate to his testimony; 6) Ddo miracles so that he might prove he was more than a man; 7) be born in such an unbelievably low estate to prove that the resulting movement was not just political; 8) choose only 12 lowly fishermen and leave it to them to carry on, to prove it was not a human thing; 9) have it happen in a period of time where the accurate recording of history and representation of people was considered in the highest possible light; 10) get four different records from four totally different people about the testimony so people after could know it was true; 11) get records of the development of the first Christians (including their letters) to show it wasn’t just a people thing; 12) have the testimony of average Jo Christians today (whatever you might say) and have them change from bad people to good – check out the Welsh revivals of the late 1800s some time – official records that there was no violent crime tried in the entire country for one year. The mines closed down because the horses couldn’t understand their masters any more because they had stopped using foul language. Supernatural change in people’s lives

You go on about a lack of evidence, what evidence do you want? What exactly could God have done more that what I’ve just mentioned? Ponder it just 30 seconds before you answer. Maybe put his design throughout the world so that any plumber Jo can see it and believe and so that lots of scientists past and presents have seen it too as they researched? Not exactly sure what evidence you’d expect? A personal visit… we both know you’d do the David Hume thing.

What interests me is how adamant you are about it being untrue. If only you were a little more ponderous it would at least give the appearance of objectivity.

Posted by Bruce Lowe

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Can the Prodigal Son be an Evangelistic Talk? 01

2 05 2009
Terry O'Quinn
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Luke is in the habit of telling short parables in pairs (11:31-32, 12:24-27, 13:18-21, 14:28-32). In chapter 15 the lost sheep and coin form such a pair as seen by their similar structures and language.

At first the Prodigal son (Luke 15:11-32) may seem to not be directly connected. Its not in the doublet, and unlike the first two parables, there is a bit of a break (“then Jesus said” – though no change in scene or audience). And yet by the end no one can doubt that this is a direct continuation. The father’s closing words to the older son are strike the same key words as the first two parables: “But we had to celebrate and rejoice, because this brother of yours was dead and has come to life, he was lost and have been found” (v32).

A big question today though is whether any of these three parables should be used in evangelism. I think its a bit of a “bug bear”. The prodigal has been a classic evangelistic text, yet more recently there has been a move to see it as all about the older brother. Answering this question is really important for preaching Luke 15 and for evangelism. But it is also a great case study for how to read the bible in general and Luke in particular…

Posted by Bruce Lowe

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Conversation with an Atheist Friend (06)

30 04 2009
The repute and reality of being a Roman emperor
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And further….

Me: give me some references

Friend: isn’t that your job?

Me: Nothing like this comes to mind.

Friend: but my point is that he was supposedly performing lots of miracles, and had crowds.

Me: We have the discovery at Oxyrhynchus of thousands of letter if this is what you mean but that’s in Egypt. I don’t know of such records for Judea. Besides the letters were pretty sporadic. The guys who wrote these records down almost certainly wrote at a time when people who were there were alive. Your point is also a good one about the Romans. What they were obsessive about was good history. SO… if four (and possibly more) different records are circulated to people who are still alive and then the movement gains momentum to the point where the empire is Christianized, this says something. How does it take root in a history obsessed society if it is historically crappy?

Friend: but it didn’t take root until the 4th or 5th century!

Me: Rome wasn’t built in the day.

Friend: it just looks like a political movement.

Me: We know for sure that several Roman Emperors tried to kill people off on mass – that’s got to slow things down a little. Nero for one. There must have been a significant number of Christians to feed the hungry lions. And still regroup after. The problem in all this – and I’m not trying to be smart in saying this – is that the Kuhnian discussion I began with about enlightenment optimism is very important. I am not anti-science in the least. There just has to be level headed realization that no one is objective as they think and questions must be asked like this – if God really wanted to prove he existed what might he do? Put his fingerprints all over the world in terms of order… yes but this will be dismissed as rubbish… no proof at all… you just think this because you have an un-evolved sense of complexity and probability. But why does evidence look good to one person and bad to another? It is because they are functioning within a paradigm to look for what fits and to discard what doesn’t – you and me both. Like the broad generality about religion being evil and causing evil. The evidence doesn’t stack up. I heard a statistic the other day (from an official source) that conservative Christians give more money to the poor than their counterparts and that if everyone in the US gave as much blood as these people they’d be turning people away. Sure when it becomes an ideology in the hands of divisive or greedy people it gets distorted, but the same could be said of any ideology throughout history – whether political systems or football supporters, or whatever. All this proves is that we have evolved follow a pack mentality – Kuhn again!

Friend: I find it hilarious that evangelicals are now in bed with post-modernists. You are so far out on a subjectivist limb, that you can’t climb down. You know, it’s fine to admit that you can’t ARGUE about this stuff. You can just throw your hands up and say, “You just gotta believe me, because I just believe it, OK?” And I can say, “Huh?” As Dennett says, there are many reasons why people SAY they are christian.

Posted by Bruce Lowe

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Conversation with an Atheist Friend (05)

26 04 2009
ufo, jesus-question-answer
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Continuing….

Me: You are making out that my whole point is what I cannot prove. This isn’t about disproving, it’s about dealing with the evidence (in this case for Jesus). My point is simply that you have to go beyond science. Neither am I bagging science or its value. In its realm it is good and fine. But it is a constructed paradigm meant not only to discover true, but to perpetuate the pursuit of an understanding of the closed system we call planet earth.

Friend: How, exactly, do you “go beyond science”

Me: One simple example. You have a manuscript which is evidence for something…

Friend: literature is not science.

Me: That’s what I mean. The evidence for the UFO may be the guy’s burnt feet, but this is a piece of evidence which you must decide on… how does science help you make this decision.

Friend: but in the case of the UFO, there isn’t even burnt feet and in the case of Jesus there is nothing except what is in the bible. Aren’t you studying biblical archeology? You know there are million dollar prizes for evidence that Jesus existed? What have you found?

Me: Now we’re talking – of course I’m just in it for the money like everyone else

Friend: I don’t know what it would take. Seems like even the fate of your so-called immortal soul isn’t enough to conjure anything at all.

Me: OK. Let’s start by asking what kind of historical evidence you might expect for a carpenter who gets killed like a common criminal and has a bunch of fishermen as his followers… Actually you could start by asking why he got crucified in the first place.

Friend: I would expect the Romans, obsessive record keepers, to have written something down.

Me: In Rome perhaps, but not in the backwater of the empire.

Friend: but they wrote lots of less impressive stuff down.

Me: Who are you referring to? Seneca, Pliny?

Friend: no in the roman province of Judea there are lots of records about all kinds of mundane stuff.

Me: give me some references

Posted by Bruce Lowe

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Conversation with an Atheist Friend (04)

22 04 2009
UFO
UFO (via last.fm)

Friend: Sorry, which god have I expressed a disbelief in? People have proposed a lot of different gods. If you mean Yahweh from the bible, then it is meaningless to say whether you believe in him or not — some people have proposed that he exists but haven’t demonstrated it in any way that can be verified. (Equally, people have proposed that UFOs have secretly abducted them in the night but have failed to back it up with any evidence.). The UFO claims have actually got more veracity because they are made by people who are still alive. As I said at the beginning, the claims that the bible does make that can be tested have all been shown to be wrong, or simply obvious even to the jewish goat herders who wrote them. The onus is on the proposer to back up their claims with honest, open debate and with clear instructions on how anyone can reproduce the effect or experiment. If you just want to state something, especially something as extraordinary as what is claimed by Christians, then don’t expect people to take you seriously unless you can back it up. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

[break… and other “chit chat”]

Me:… Well anyway here is my response to our ongoing discussion… “Enlightenment optimism” means you are overly optimistic about what scientific method can achieve. Science cannot prove non-repeatable events. Thus science cannot prove history. Science can help in the establishment of history by creating analytical methods (my own PhD specialty) for testing the validity of historical evidence or by refining information about it, but it cannot actually prove a non-repeated event. You have to be able to repeat an experiment enough times statistically to show it must definitely be the case.If the UFO guy has burn marks on the soles of his feet and his car had the top ripped off, this is evidence but what you do with that evidence has nothing to do with science. Science has no comment to make (except probably to say that it could have naturally been caused by, x y or z). It has everything to do with how skeptical or otherwise you decide to be with the evidence. Add to this 100 different things and science still cannot prove whether he was abducted or not. Now let’s say you were the guy. How do you know you weren’t just tripping out somehow? In fact you may know of David Hume the philosopher, who essentially said that if you experienced a miracle you’d be safer going for any other explanation than to accept that it was a miracle. Can science prove that Jesus didn’t walk on water? Of course not. Can science prove that he didn’t do miracles? Of course not. Can science prove that he didn’t rise from the dead? Of course not. If God is Jesus how else is he going to give evidence to humans except to become a person so we can identify with him, and then do things that show he’s not bound by the laws of nature? Actually now I think about it, Jesus did give scientific evidence that he is God – he did miracles on repeated occasions under varying experimental conditions (there’s a thought)! But of course this is crap, and you’re 100% sure god can’t exist. Why? Because you are operating on a pre-disposition (due to a marriage with science) that the supernatural doesn’t exist. You’ve made a prior decision, and through this you interpret everything. But don’t pretend this is scientific. It is a paradigm, as Kuhn would put it. Check out Alistair McGrath (a not so unintelligent) microbiologist and theologian who teaches at Oxford and has had a few things to say to Richard D about his enlightenment optimism.

Friend: But despite what you say, science does work, and scientific truth is nothing more than common sense and places no demands on you than following instructions. On the other hand, Christianity requires you, to paraphrase Saint Doug, “to believe 10 impossible things before breakfast.” And your ‘critique’ of science that says that, because science can’t prove a negative — i.e. that something DOES NOT exist — belies a lack of understanding of how science works. For example, you can’t prove that Zeus or Thor don’t exist. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_Popper. But if you really want to have an argument about proving or disproving the existence of supernatural stuff then science actually does have something to say. It says, “show me any effect, however slight, on anything, anywhere, that cannot be explained by known science,”

Posted by Bruce Lowe

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